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The Trial Lawyers College Podcast

The Trial Lawyers College Podcast talks to leading attorneys, TLC board members, and faculty about the ideas and the issues that are affecting trial lawyers today. The TLC podcast covers courtroom strategy, communicating with jurors, connecting with clients, methods that drive success, balancing healthy relationships with a busy practice and more.
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The Trial Lawyers College Podcast
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Now displaying: Category: general
Sep 11, 2022

Eric Davis, our newest TLC Board Member, shares his wisdom, his leadership, and a few personal stories which add up to the greatest piece of advice I have yet to hear on this podcast.  Don't give up, get better!

Sep 7, 2022

State Representative and Trial Lawyer Ann Johnson discusses her new role as a member of the board of directors for the Trial Lawyers College and how she uses TLC methods in the courtroom, the legislature, and as a politician with equal force and effect. 

Aug 29, 2022

Come and listen to Greg Westfalls' insightful, inspirational and creative use of real historical events, exhibited in museums in Montgomery, Alabama, for training purposes for the defense of the damned and in representing the condemned, the downtrodden, and the damned. 

Aug 10, 2022

Tenured law professor and trial lawyer Carolos Concepcion offers insight into TLC methods from his own experience researching the effect of emotions on humans. 

Aug 9, 2022

Advocacy traverses our nation's boundaries.  Listen as Barrister Paul O'Grady explains the Irish court system and his comparison to our system in the US.

Jul 28, 2022

Todd Kelly details TLC winning methods leading to a recent settlement in a trucking case at mediation.  Learn how his client's story and use of story boards through expert witness depositions became the gift that kept on giving. 

Jul 5, 2022

Maren Chaloupka explains the exciting symbiotic relationship between the moth storytelling techniques and TLC.  Maren is the director and leader of the Grad 2 Course for Trial Lawyers College where new and innovative techniques, curriculum, and personal development are taught by outstanding faculty.  Maren details Grad 2 Course and issues an open invitation for all TLC graduates.

Jul 5, 2022

TLC Grad and faculty member Eric Fong explain the connection and path to the empathy he learned at the 3-Week TLC flagship course.  Listen carefully as Eric explains how TLC opened up a new world of creativity in his profession and personal life.  Don't miss this podcast. 

Jun 17, 2022

Learn how major Grethe Hahn represented a convicted and previously sentenced to death member of the armed forces and successfully beat the sentence of death in the retrial. 

Jun 17, 2022

Listen to course co-director Stephen Demik describe the outstanding trial skills course which is coming up soon.  Each director gives detailed examples of the benefits of attending this trial skills course that you won't want to miss.  Tune in and experience an uplifting program with real-life examples for us to all learn from them.

Jun 17, 2022

Listen to course director Jim Leach describe the outstanding trial skills course which is coming up soon.  Each director gives detailed examples of the benefits of attending TLC's Trial Skills Foundation seminar that you won't want to miss.  Tune in and experience an uplifting program with real-life examples for us all to learn from. 

May 10, 2022
Join our special holiday interview with Valerie Malone as she discusses the season of giving. Valerie and Rafe exchange stories of good tidings and cheer.
Dec 16, 2021

“It’s integrity. If you don’t have integrity in your thoughts, it’s going to show. You’re going to come across as fake, and nobody wants to be associated with that.”

Victoria Rusk, a mitigation specialist and investigator from Houston, TX, credits the Trial Lawyers College’s In Defense of the Damned program with giving her the tools that enhance her civil case preparation and her strategy for consulting criminal defense attorneys. She helps clients understand what mitigation is and how the discovery and presentation of their background is critical to saving their life. 

The TLC method teaches that if the jury perceives that an attorney is disconnected from or embarrassed about their client, the jury could adopt that bias and judge the client harshly. Drawing from this, Rusk feels that assessing the case and witnesses help a lawyer better understand their clients’ background. 

When attorneys genuinely empathize with their clients, they can present their client’s mitigation story in a compelling way that helps jurors to overcome the feelings of anger stirred up by the prosecutor. Trial Lawyers College teaches lawyers to identify universal themes to be those many people can relate to, such as parenthood or significant loss.

“As a mitigation specialist, we meet people where they are.”

Dec 15, 2021

“It is the idea of just being yourself and connecting and being genuine and not just pretending to be genuine but being actually genuine...see how that actually works.”

This fall, former prosecutor Adam Murray enjoyed training at the Trial Lawyers College intensive five-day course in Shambhala, Colorado. Although he is not yet a TLC graduate, he describes his time at the TLC as a “life-changing experience.” After leaving the seminar, he determined that the tools provided an entirely different perspective that would benefit all aspects of trial preparation, beginning with Voir Dire. 

“How can I be empowered to make sure that my client can get their story before the jury so that the right result happens?”

Being able to authentically connect with the jurors from the beginning of the process helps attorneys avoid seeming adversarial. It allows lawyers to work collaboratively with the jury and to practice the law while retaining their humanity.

Murray has since added a psychodrama room onto his office space for helping clients prepare for trial, so they would be better able to live out the critical moment on the stand. As they express their feelings regarding the experience, jurors can identify with the victim and their loss.

Nov 5, 2021

“Lawyers get bogged down in minutiae and facts. The facts are important. The facts are the latticework upon which you hang the flesh of your case, and the flesh of your case is going to be the principles, the values, the emotion, the feelings, the betrayal; those types of things are what make a case relatable to a jury.”

This week, Kenny Adair, former district judge and 2007 graduate of the Trial Lawyer College (TLC), attributes his success to TLC. When he left the program, he felt better equipped to discover and understand his clients’ stories and tell them in a way that the jury would embrace. Through the use of reenactments, among other methods, he can discover the backstory and connect personally and emotionally to each case.

Adair tells the essential story during voir dire, during the opening statement, when questioning the clients and witnesses, and during the closing argument. He identifies the hero or would-be hero and the villain, the liable party. He shows the villain’s betrayal and is ready to capitalize on the defense counsel’s trial behavior that compounds the original harm to the client.

Nov 5, 2021

“You’ve got to understand who your audience is really is. What are the morals of your jury? Once you understand their morals and whether they’re liberal or conservative, and you tailor your opening statement towards that, you’re well on your way to getting the verdict that you want.”

In this episode of the TLC Podcast, host Rafe Foreman meets with Kentucky-based trial lawyer Frank Mungo to discuss his unique approach to storytelling to resonate with the judge and jury in a variety of criminal cases. Guiding listeners through the details of some of his most successful trials, Frank provides an insightful look at the personal values and political biases that can influence judges’ and jurors’ connections with our clients and the ultimate outcome of a case. 

Nov 3, 2021

“If the cancer is a wake-up call to spend the rest of my life—however long I have—to live a life with more quality and being more genuine, I’m not thinking that’s too unfair.” 

This episode of the TLC Podcast features Laurie Goodman, the beloved executive director of the Trial Lawyers College, who speaks with host Rafe Foreman about her April 2021 diagnosis of metastatic breast cancer. As she shares the insights she’s discovered about herself in the wake of her ongoing health struggles, Laurie offers a critical reminder of the value of accepting one’s life path, surrendering control, and making today the very best it can be.

Sep 23, 2021

“We are in a different mindset than our clients are. Even that is a barrier because, at that point, we don’t see the context where our client comes from.” 

This week’s TLC podcast features trial lawyer Pat Montes, who offers a thought-provoking look at how language and culture impact a lawyer’s relationships with their clients. Bringing to the table her unique perspective as a bilingual and bicultural attorney, Pat stresses the importance of working with clients in their native language rather than forcing them to struggle to convey their authentic story in English. 

As Pat and host Rafe Foreman continue their discussion, they raise a new set of questions: How can a client relate to their lawyer when they come from entirely different backgrounds? And how can a lawyer discover their client’s story when their cultural differences, despite both speaking English, effectively mean they’re speaking different languages?

The answers to these questions and more are explored in-depth in this engaging podcast episode. Listen along as Pat and Rafe provide necessary insight into connecting with a diverse set of clients and ensuring equal justice for all.

Sep 15, 2021

“There are people who do bad things, but I’ve never met anybody who I felt was just a bad person.”

Continuing our series on ‘Reconstructing Success,’ California Public Defender Emily Fisher explores the ways that trial lawyers can intentionally improve injustices and inefficiencies in the justice system. As she guides listeners through her blueprint to resolving these systemic issues, Emily provides a thought-provoking starting point for the empathic trial lawyer to fine-tune their advocacy for their clients and bring humanity back into the courtroom.

Sep 15, 2021

“When we tell good stories, the listeners engage.”

This week, host Rafe Foreman meets with accomplished civil trial lawyer Scott Glovsky to explore his methods of successfully conveying the emotion behind his clients’ stories to the jury. A passionate advocate for individuals who’ve faced unjust denials by their health insurance companies, Scott delves into the intersection between the struggles of his clients and the motivations of their insurers. 

As the episode comes to a close, Rafe and Scott encourage listeners to think about the underlying emotional connection that their story is conveying. Is it adequate? Is it complete? Is it thorough? These are all essential questions a trial lawyer must ask themselves to ensure that they can lead the jury to find justice for their clients.

Aug 16, 2021

“There are so many people who have incredible talents that are going to waste because they’ve been excluded. It’s not hard to find if you just open your eyes….and when we see it, we need to use our position of power and privilege in the groups and organizations that we’re leading to elevate that talent and allow them to have the space to shine.”

This week, trial lawyer and legal educator Keeley Blanchard joins Rafe Foreman in an integral discussion on the importance of inclusion, diversity, and representation in the legal profession. 

As a trainer of public defenders, Keeley explains how valuable it can be for members of underserved communities to see and be taught by legal leaders who share a key part of their identity, whether that’s their race, disability, gender, or sexual orientation. However, Keeley reminds listeners of the barriers that currently limit that from happening at the frequency that it should, prompting her to explore the solutions to this pressing issue. 

As Rafe and Keeley dissect this issue from the perspective of their own marginalized identities as well as their points of privilege, they encourage legal professionals and leaders to identify the biases they have within themselves and to do the work to overcome them in order to provide a safe and welcoming space for all.

Aug 16, 2021

John Sloan hosts the TLC Podcast this week to interview Rafe Foreman and partner attorney Susan Hutchison on the incredible verdict the two trial lawyers won in a groundbreaking and unconventional gender discrimination case. 

Listen along as Rafe and Susan describe how they successfully conveyed their 72-year-old client’s story to the jury after a false sexual assault accusation led to him losing his 20-year job with an HVAC company. In a compelling episode led by a dynamic group of voices that TLC students have come to know and love over the years, John leads Rafe and Susan as they provide a powerful testament to the efficacy of the psychodramatic methods and the value of truly reaching one’s client to discover the winning story.

Jul 20, 2021

“Everything I need to know I learned in psychodrama. I remind myself to listen with my heart, tune into the emotions -- not just the words -- be open, be honest, and be kind because we have more in common than we’ll ever know...and to be fearless because no matter how alone we’re feeling, we are never alone and our TLC group -- every single one of them -- will be there to help you when you’re going through a problem.”

This week, host Rafe Foreman is joined by Connie Taylor Henderson, who practices law with her husband and her son in Vancouver, Washington. Continuing our current podcast series titled “Restructuring Success,” Connie backpacks off of the upcoming Warrior Magazine theme with an engaging dive into why TLC is worth fighting for. 

By sharing the impact that TLC has had on her life both personally and professionally and reflecting on TLC’s past, present, and future in these turbulent yet promising times, Connie’s words are sure to resonate with all who have been touched by the TLC methods.

Jul 13, 2021

“Do something to make someone else’s day better. If we all do that, every day, we’ll change the world.”

This week, Washington attorney Mark Wagner continues our ‘Restructuring Success’ series with a refreshing take on the true meaning of success. Channeling the core message of the Trial Lawyers College, Mark argues that success is all in how we treat others. Through engaging storytelling and a matter-of-fact method of expression, Mark reminds listeners of the humanity in all of us and that we are more alike than we are different.

Jul 7, 2021

“Success is really subjective, and I think that’s okay. The only thing that I need to do to live truthfully is to define the things that are important to me and let the rest burn. What’s scarier -- disappointing people or thinking, at the end of the day, what kind of life could I have had if I had just been a little bit braver?”

This week, Ilinois criminal defense attorney Cambry McNabb joins host Rafe Foreman to explore the true meaning of success. As a young lawyer who attended the Trial Lawyers College early in her career, Cambry has had her fair share of successes, but not all of those successes had perfect outcomes. Discussing the most noteworthy trials and tribulations of her legal practice, Cambry treats listeners to a thought-provoking dive into what it means to win or lose a case.

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